Aug 14th

[FearingPix]

So I am shooting a wedding for my cousin the 14th of August. This will be my first one by my self. Any one have any tips or suggestions for me?

[Thomas McKown]

You might want to make a list of the shots you want to get so that you don't forget during the wedding. Things like the ring shots, details you don't want to miss, arrangements of people in the formals that are vital, and so on.

Aside from making sure to capture everything you want to capture, I would also suggest you be willing to take charge, especially during the formals. You want to make sure that when you are taking the professional shots that people aren't looking at other people's cameras. Don't be afraid to nicely ask the other guests to not distract the people who are getting their pictures taken until they are through.

Another thing, be sure to check and double check you camera's settings both before and in between events. You want to make sure you aren't shooting at ISO 1600 unless you have to, and being in JPEG mode could just ruin your day when you get home if you were counting on doing RAW adjustments.

Feel free to introduce yourself to other vendors at the wedding. Making friends with them could benefit the both of you down the road. Just be yourself and be flexible. Relaxing and just having fun will make the experience more enjoyable for everybody, nobody likes an uptight vendor of any kind.

[FearingPix]

thank you, you know....this would be alot easier if you was in the area and only getting a couple hundred bucks for it. lol jk i will definitely start writing a list.

[Sara Adams]

First step you want to take is drop everything you are doing and move back to Tennessee.

Just kidding....kinda.

You should wear something that fits you and is comfy yet professional looking, like a button up shirt, some dark jeans, and comfortable yet simple shoes (like brown shoes or black shoes, I wouldn't really suggest sneakers).

Be yourself and be creative! You have a unique and funky style and you should keep that as much as possible. Candids are something that I think everyone should do, so shoot when people think you're not looking or paying attention. (You should be a ninja, basically) It doesn't matter if they're in the wedding party or not -- shooting friends, kids, and family members candidly is great for the bride and groom, as it shows them everything that they might have missed.

During the ceremony and before, make sure to pay attention to the overall emotion of those around you, if anyone is crying, be sure to take a picture of it! Capturing someone within a raw emotional state makes for a great photograph for the bride and groom.

Ask the bride and groom if there are any shots that are high on their list. It is important to ask this because some brides and grooms want shots of guests sitting down at their assigned tables or lots of photographs of their parents.

Don't get too angle crazy; make sure all of your photographs are pretty straight. Also make sure that your focusing is where you want it, it is vital to get the focus point exact or it could make the photograph less interesting or a total dud.

Like Thomas suggested, make friends and chat up with the other vendors during down time! You will meet a lot of awesome vendors that you can keep in touch with. Be sure to ask for a business card and exchange yours.

I think you will do awesome and there should be no reason to feel nervous. I can't wait to see what you get.

[everlastingimages]

"Ask the bride and groom if there are any shots that are high on their list. It is important to ask this because some brides and grooms want shots of guests sitting down at their assigned tables or lots of photographs of their parents."

Ha! I don't do table shots anymore, it's in the contract. I feel that is such a waste of valuable shooting time while other important events are occurring during the reception. I also do not guarantee any formal poses presented on shot lists, there are just waaaay to many variables that come into play on the wedding day that are outside of my control to make that promise.

Biggest piece of advice I have...

Get an itinerary from the client and have a shooting plan, know where you're going to go and how much time you're going to need.

[Sara Adams]

Jul 21, 2010 18:42:42 GMT -5 everlastingimages said:

Ha! I don't do table shots anymore, it's in the contract. I feel that is such a waste of valuable shooting time while other important events are occurring during the reception. I also do not guarantee any formal poses presented on shot lists, there are just waaaay to many variables that come into play on the wedding day that are outside of my control to make that promise.

I really would prefer not to do table shots, but some brides really want it. I personally find it rude to go up to a bunch of people while they're eating and ask if I could take their picture, but to me, the bride and groom want what they want. I honestly wouldn't mind it if the guests knew that it was requested, otherwise I just find it rude. Thankfully though, this has only been an issue once for us.

I don't see anything wrong with asking if the bride would like any extra shots as long as there is free time to take them. The thing is... people do not understand that a wedding photographers job is to shoot the main events, they think you can read their minds. So if you miss any shots that the bride wanted, although that's not what you're there for, they might give you a hard time about it. It's silly but I think it's a good thing to ask if there are any shots the bride wants that is on the top of their list.

[everlastingimages]

Throughout the course of the day there is nothing wrong with asking the bride if there are any shots that she wants, this is primarily during the family formal session. The clientèle that I pursue though rarely care about the formals and only shoot them to appease the parents. The only time I've had table shots requested was by parents, and never by a bride or groom. I even asked that specific bride and groom if they wanted me to take those photos and they said no, but the mom chewed me a new after the wedding because they weren't taken. That's why it is now contracted. The only real time to get table shots is during the meal, at which time we're usually backing up and eating ourselves before the major events at the reception. Table shots are from a bygone era, prior to wedding photojournalism or digital photography, when it was unheard of to snap 1,200 frames at a wedding, point being, we are now more capable of capturing the candid memories of the clients guests as opposed to the stiff formal boring table photos.

I also think the market differs the further south you travel, where more traditional values come into play. In Ohio, requests like these are really rare. We're booked because we provide a mix of PJ and creative portraiture, less value is placed on the formal capabilities.

[Sara Adams]

I wasn't exactly talking about formal shots but more so about certain things like if the bride and groom want you to take some candid photographs of their parents, kids, grandparents, family, and friends in particular. For example, when a bride comes up to you and asks if you would take a picture of her cousin dancing with her niece at the reception; she could just assume you were shooting it already or she could ask.

Now you're probably thinking to yourself "well that's the point of taking loads of candid photographs", yes, that is the point -however you could miss so much without knowing who is who and their relation to the bride and groom.

I think it's a good idea just to run it over with the bride so you know everything she is expecting from you as the hired photographer. I like to ask the clients beforehand what shots they're really looking for before everything gets hectic so that way it's in the back of my mind. We never really ask if they want table shots or eight million formal shots, we just ask if there are any shots in particular that they really want us to get. Luckily many of our brides are very organized and already have a list of shots they want, so asking does not happen often.

Judging by the amount of weddings we've done so far; Ohio weddings are extremely different from weddings here in Tennessee. The weddings are actually not as formal, very laid back, and usually do not go past 7 PM. The reason I used table shots as an example was because a bride of ours was disappointed that we did not get table shots; although we had no clue she wanted them. I wasn't suggesting that Kyle go up and ask if they want table shots, just any shots in particular. I suppose my first reply was a poor example on my part of what I actually meant.


I hope that makes sense.

[Thomas McKown]

Jul 21, 2010 19:25:51 GMT -5 everlastingimages said:

I also think the market differs the further south you travel, where more traditional values come into play. In Ohio, requests like these are really rare. We're booked because we provide a mix of PJ and creative portraiture, less value is placed on the formal capabilities.

So far in our experience, (although we haven't shot nearly as many weddings as you have) down here in the south, it is the family and parents who want the stiff posed stuff as well. I think that is the case no matter where you are located to be honest. What seems to be drawing in clients in their words is "creativity." One of our clients came to us because of my background in landscape photography and was later thrilled with Sara's style because they have similar taste. They love the vintage era and really liked the candid style of shooting we did at their very informal farm wedding. That one bride lead to the rest of the weddings we booked this season.

Like you, we are trying to market to the younger generation that likes the less formal, more creative pictures. I think that seems to be the growing trend.

Now back to Kyle... That said, you have something that is unique to your competitors, your style. You do the quirky candid stuff really well. People who shoot outside the box don't have to worry about the latest trends in the market, they set the latest trends in the market. You have a unique way of identifying with the most unlikely subjects, like kids. I think you have a great potential in the market if you just do what you love, work extremely hard, and be very fun to work with. I think if you stay true to your roots, the right work will find you. All you have to do is put yourself out in front of enough people.

[everlastingimages]

Although I see your point, we usually have pretty good coverage on the dance floor. The only problem I see arising from this though is, say the bride says she wants a nice candid of Uncle Bob and Aunt Sally, it's really important, but after the ceremony they disappear, or at the reception they are across the room from each other talking to different people. If you asked the bride, and she answered, she now has the expectation that you will get the shot. With candids and PJ there are just never any guarantees that you'll be able to get the promised shot. I set the expectations low so that the bride is then excited and blown away by what is captured in the candid moments.

In reality, anytime we have asked for bridal input we get the standard list of photos that gets pulled off of theknot.com, it's all standard and routine stuff that we shoot anyway. That's another reason why we stopped requesting input. Anytime we did get oddball shots, they were usually pulled from famous west coast photographer's blogs and were location dependent in order to pull of successfully.... ie. Shots in the ocean, or on a cliff, etc. And in general I am usually offended when I am asked to "carbon copy" someone else's work.

For me, my website and my portfolio are my expectations, the clients see what we do, and they hire us for that vision and style. Since we have switched from a client input model to a Just trust us to do our job model, we have had far less client complaints about missed images, and overall, client satisfaction has actually increased dramatically. But again, this is all dependent on the clientèle that you are pursuing, since our launch we have found that lower end brides tended to want micro-management over their photography, and the mid-range to higher-end brides were extremely hands off. I had more problems with $795.00 clients and their expectations than I have ever had with $2500.00 clients.

Table shots or not, my contract clause clearly states we do not guarantee any specific images, it's like telling the bride that you guarantee 100% that it's not going to rain on their wedding day.

[Sara Adams]

I totally understand what you're saying and agree with you 100%. I don't want people to make me into something I'm not as well as expect me to take photographs of someone who disappears five seconds after they eat a slice of cake. I just don't think I'm phrasing what I mean in the best way and everything is being taken differently, so I'm going to just end it at; I agree with you wholeheartedly.

However, because Kyle is so new and this is his first wedding on his own, they're not going to him based on his style but more so based on the price factor. I think it is smart for Kyle to ask what they expect him to get because he is so new within the business and has time to learn; once he gets the hang of things he won't need to ask.

You're coming from someone who is established in the photography business, but Kyle is coming from only shooting two weddings as an assistant. I think anything Kyle gets at this wedding, even if it's formals and table shots, the clients will be impressed because I'm sure they don't have the highest expectations; they just want someone to document the day for cheap. Once Kyle becomes more established within the wedding photography business, people will come to him because of his style and not try and make him into something he is not. I think asking the clients what they want is a great way of learning how to do things and what people expect, plus it eases their minds a little bit.

[everlastingimages]

I was actually about to comment and say almost exactly what you just did. I think that asking the bride for input when you are a startup is a perfectly good idea until you learn the flow of events and have a style developed. I guess it's all a part of paying your dues as you work your way up the ladder. I understand what you're saying, I wasn't trying to argue.

[Thomas McKown]

Jul 21, 2010 20:35:29 GMT -5 everlastingimages said:

But again, this is all dependent on the clientèle that you are pursuing, since our launch we have found that lower end brides tended to want micro-management over their photography, and the mid-range to higher-end brides were extremely hands off. I had more problems with $795.00 clients and their expectations than I have ever had with $2500.00 clients.

You bring up a very good point about marketing in general. You are dead on with your point I might add. Generally people tend to have more problems at the low end of a market than at the higher end for several reasons. One is the mindset of somebody shopping at the low end of a particular market. Another is because of a perception of who and what they are dealing with.

Somebody shopping for a budget option is going to want that option to emulate something of a higher class. Somebody shopping at the higher end of the market is going to expect nothing more than what that company has established itself on. Now, this is not true for all shoppers in the low end of the market, some are just simply not able to afford the higher end of the market and will be thrilled if what they are getting is of high quality. This seems to be the majority of what we have dealt with so far, but I do know that the micro-managers are out there and we are bound to run across them eventually, especially at the low end.

You just have to be able to back up your prices with quality, professionalism, experience, creativity (the ability to set the trends) and speed. I lack in speed and experience, but am stronger in the quality, professionalism, and creative areas, so my prices suffer until I can master all of those areas. I guess its just a matter of balance and discovering what the market says you are worth.

[everlastingimages]

I know that the first wedding we ever shot solo the biggest issue we had was crowd control. Getting people motivated and moving after the Ceremony was the hardest part of the day, and I hadn't even really assisted at a wedding at this point, so I had no concept of flow or how to get people indoors for formals. Again, this breaks down to having a good itinerary from the bride that you carry with you. That way if the bride and groom get carried away with greeting their guests afterwards you can kindly remind them about the available time and keep things moving.

[Thomas McKown]

All great advice so far! Kyle, you writing this down?